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Shandy
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« Reply #30 on: April 09, 2017, 07:35:10 AM »

Robb/Jack - Both great stories, TY Smiley
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"The small man builds prisons for everyone he meets, but the wise woman ducks under the moon and tosses keys to the beautiful and rowdy prisoners."  Hafiz

"From childhood's hour I have not been as other were - have not seen as others saw - I could not drink(sic) my passions from a common stream.
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« Reply #31 on: April 09, 2017, 09:13:48 AM »

Except that I screwed up .. I was thinking of Dinant on the Meuse River .. not Bruges     ...  in my defense, I was drunk a lot back in those days, the 60s are just a big blur.
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Robb_K
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« Reply #32 on: April 09, 2017, 10:59:20 AM »

Amsterdam was fun to experience, but I wouldn't want to live there.

Bruges is nice,  I loved the canals.  I lived near there for six months in a small farm town (Florennes) , renting a room over a bar .. happy days !

Florennes is in Namur, a Walloon  (French-speaking area of Belgium)(as is Dinant).  Bruges (Brugge) is in the Flemish (Dutch-speaking part).  The difference is like night and day.  I have family both in the Flemish areas (Antwerpen and Brussel), and in The French. Liege (Luik).  Did you pick up some French speech?  I live in a small village of 300 people and no shops, with several canals, and near 3 windmills from the 1800s (in Noord Holland).  It's similar to Florennes in how it looks.
« Last Edit: April 10, 2017, 02:31:26 AM by Robb_K » Logged

doctordoowop
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« Reply #33 on: April 09, 2017, 12:53:57 PM »

At the same time

I enjoyed  the incredible hospitality of Amsterdam--all  sales  girls  lying down in the  windows  beckoning me in.  So friendly! Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin
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DJ Big Jack
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« Reply #34 on: April 09, 2017, 11:03:39 PM »

doctor,   first time in Amsterdam, I was with my wife and kids, we went to a shop and the owner gave us a discount coupon to his brothers restaurant . but told us to go during the day.   I didn't know why.  We went in the afternoon and had a leisurely meal .. afterwards, we went outside and it was twilight .. we were in the middle of the Red Light District and yeah, my ikids wanted to know why there were beds in the shop windows with ladies lying in them.
« Last Edit: April 09, 2017, 11:07:22 PM by DJ Big Jack » Logged

DJ Big Jack
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« Reply #35 on: April 09, 2017, 11:06:48 PM »

Robb,  I picked up a few words of French, but not much.  It was an interesting experience .. I was in the US Army , stationed with the US Air Force on a Belgian Air Force base (we were doing nuclear bomb control and support for their bombers.)
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doctordoowop
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« Reply #36 on: April 09, 2017, 11:53:42 PM »

A surprise  Jack  if don't  expect it.


Nothing compares  with Burgos  st  in Manila   for  aggressive women--8-10at a time! Grin Grin Grin Grin
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bklynmike101
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« Reply #37 on: April 10, 2017, 12:27:19 AM »

Went to Amsterdam as a tourist and loved it (no, I din't do cat houses or other "funny" step Amsterdam is known for. Also loved delft. Of course, being a tourist in a spot for a few days or a week is a far cry from the experience of living there. 
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Shandy
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« Reply #38 on: April 10, 2017, 01:08:15 AM »

I went to Amsterdam twice and once stayed for three months.  Not the same as living there (I didn't get a job or sign a lease, for instance) but I knew I could live there easily.  You can walk everywhere and bike for trips into the countryside.  Seemed like the best of both worlds to me.  The red light district (they tried to get myattention, too) is near all the old churches, so you didn't get that tacky feel.  But there was an area that seemed to be run by Israelis and had these gambling machines.  These guys were very aggressive, trying to pull you in off the street.  Good, plain food and killer baked goods were cheap and plentiful and you got three US for one gilder.  That was a while back, I'm sure lots have changed, but I'd still know my way around the streets.
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"The small man builds prisons for everyone he meets, but the wise woman ducks under the moon and tosses keys to the beautiful and rowdy prisoners."  Hafiz

"From childhood's hour I have not been as other were - have not seen as others saw - I could not drink(sic) my passions from a common stream.
Robb_K
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« Reply #39 on: April 10, 2017, 02:28:41 AM »

I went to Amsterdam twice and once stayed for three months.  Not the same as living there (I didn't get a job or sign a lease, for instance) but I knew I could live there easily.  You can walk everywhere and bike for trips into the countryside.  Seemed like the best of both worlds to me.  The red light district (they tried to get myattention, too) is near all the old churches, so you didn't get that tacky feel.  But there was an area that seemed to be run by Israelis and had these gambling machines.  These guys were very aggressive, trying to pull you in off the street. 
I'm glad you all like The Netherlands and Amsterdam.  Although Amsterdam is a big city by Dutch standards, outside its centre, it is a bunch of individual neighbourhoods.  Although it's not my kind of place,'d rather live there than in a small town near the woods in USA.  I lived in a very big building of flats in Den Haag for 40 years, which was very like some of the outer neighbourhoods of Amsterdam.  It was on the last street, next to the woods between that city and the seaside resort, Scheveningen.  But, I don't like living in a large building with a lot of people.  In The Netherlands, I live in the top house of a duplex, with my cousin in the house below mine.  In  Germany, I live in a loft flat on the roof of a large townhouse building, just above my business partner (animation firm).  There are only 2 other house doors that share my floor, and I'm right next to the roof garden, with lots of flowers, bushes and trees, and a great view of the creek and adjacent largest city park in Europe.  In Denmark, I live in a guest house in the back of a long lot, with my Danish business partner, whose house is on the front side of a large vegetable, fruit tree and flower garden between the 2 homes.  He lives in a small town, surrounded by forest, in the far north of Sjaelland, the island on which Copenhagen lies (64 km south of us).  In Los Angeles, I know stay in my parents' house 2 blocks from Santa Monica, while fixing it up to rent it out.  My father died last year (mother 6 years ago).  In Manitoba, I stay in my sister's house, which is the house in which we grew up, in Winnipeg's last suburb, next to the woods.  They are all pretty nice places.
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Robb_K
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« Reply #40 on: April 10, 2017, 02:40:42 AM »

I went to Amsterdam twice and once stayed for three months.  Not the same as living there (I didn't get a job or sign a lease, for instance) but I knew I could live there easily.  You can walk everywhere and bike for trips into the countryside.  Seemed like the best of both worlds to me.  The red light district (they tried to get myattention, too) is near all the old churches, so you didn't get that tacky feel.  But there was an area that seemed to be run by Israelis and had these gambling machines.  These guys were very aggressive, trying to pull you in off the street.  Good, plain food and killer baked goods were cheap and plentiful and you got three US for one gilder.  That was a while back, I'm sure lots have changed, but I'd still know my way around the streets.

Wow!  You spent 3 months in Amsterdam, and didn't work there?  Were you just visiting friends?  Spreek Je een beetje Nederlands dan?

What do you mean, that you got 3 US for 1 Gulde?   3 US whats?  3 baked goods?  Does "US" stand for a type of baked good?  I'm not very up on baked goods, as I've never cared much about sweets and desserts, other than my ice cream sprees for the 1st few years after first being able to eat and drink milk products.

Certainly you couldn't mean Dollars.  Guilders were always about 55 cents US, from what I remember.
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Shandy
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« Reply #41 on: April 10, 2017, 03:26:52 AM »

Robb - The first time I stayed for a month, the second for three months.  I had the money, but of course I couldn't spend like a drunken sailor.  The first time the conversion rate was 3 gilders for 1 U.S. dollar.  The second time the exchange was not as good, but still okay.  Both times I stayed at the Hotel Alders on Jan Luykenstraat(sp).  More like a brownstone that they separated into guest rooms and my room was big, sort of like a studio apartment in Manhattan with a big dining table and terrace.  The house cat liked to stay with me, so it was very homey.  I was tripping over bakeries in the area I lived in, so each was very enticing because there was competition.  Being a New Yorker, I was surprised that they would hang the bread delivery outside the bakery door in a giant, clear plastic bag early in the morning when I was just getting in.  No one ever stole that I ever saw.  The roast beef and the mayo (which they charged extra for) butter and milk were out of this world.  You know the shops, pronounced, but not spelled "brodjeeiswinkle".  I didn't pick up much of the language because not only did most people (except the elderly) speak English, but they wanted the chance to practice, so I was spoiled.  I said "Da" and "austubleeft"(sp) a lot.  I bought flowers and bread and cheese every day.  I learned you had to bring your own shopping bag, that was new to me.  And you had to pay for lucifers (matches).  Those two visits were the only times I cried when I left a place that wasn't home.  The only place I still feel homesick for that wasn't really mine.  It just felt like it was really mine right from the start and that feeling hasn't changed.  The second time around everything was just as I left it, only my neighborhood pub, which looked exactly the same, was now Members Only and the Zeider Zee, which was so powerful and choppy, turned into a calm mirrored "lake".  Sorry, TMI, but it's a subject I warm to Smiley
« Last Edit: April 10, 2017, 07:17:11 AM by Shandy » Logged

"The small man builds prisons for everyone he meets, but the wise woman ducks under the moon and tosses keys to the beautiful and rowdy prisoners."  Hafiz

"From childhood's hour I have not been as other were - have not seen as others saw - I could not drink(sic) my passions from a common stream.
Robb_K
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« Reply #42 on: April 10, 2017, 12:05:45 PM »

 Both times I stayed at the Hotel Alders on Jan Luykenstraat(sp). I was tripping over bakeries in the area I lived in, so each was very enticing because there was competition. I was surprised that they would hang the bread delivery outside the bakery door in a giant, clear plastic bag early in the morning when I was just getting in.  No one ever stole that I ever saw.  The roast beef and the mayo (which they charged extra for) butter and milk were out of this world. I didn't pick up much of the language because not only did most people speak English. I bought flowers and bread and cheese every day. Those two visits were the only times I cried when I left a place that wasn't home. The only place I still feel homesick for that wasn't really mine. The second time around everything was just as I left it, only my neighborhood pub was now Members Only and the Zeider Zee, which was so powerful and choppy, turned into a calm mirrored "lake".
You were there for 3 months straight. You must have made some friends of the locals. What did you do each day, other than eat broodjes and kaas and buy flowers? Did you just do sight-seeing in Amsterdam, with some day trips to the countryside and outlying towns? Yes Dutch people like to show off their English. They won't speak Dutch to you until your English accent is so light, as to sound slightly foreign, but not even recognisable as American or British. That situation is almost never reached by Americans. But, after 5-7 years of living there, the people you know best will speak Dutch to you. Zuider Zee (Zuyder Zee) means "South Sea"- to distinguish it from The North Sea. Zuider is pronounced roughly half way between English "Zowwder" and Zider". It's a sound that CAN'T be made by English speakers unless they've been living in The Netherlands 20 years, or they heard Dutch spoken before age 5.  the "ieuw" in the word, nieuw is another. So are the gutterals, like the hard one, "och", as in ochtend, or soft version, "og", as in nog. Jewish Americans can make the hard one, IF they learned Hebrew at a young age. American expats usually give up trying to learn Dutch, or carry a heavy accent in their Dutch for the rest of their lives.
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doctordoowop
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« Reply #43 on: April 10, 2017, 01:12:19 PM »

Think I have an uncle who  lives in Amsterdam Grin Grin Grin.
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Robb_K
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« Reply #44 on: April 10, 2017, 01:52:53 PM »

Think I have an uncle who  lives in Amsterdam Grin Grin Grin.
Because of the so-called "coffee shops" (smoke houses) ?
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JoeC
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« Reply #45 on: April 10, 2017, 02:05:14 PM »

Visited Amsterdam twice in my life. Drove up from Germany when I was 10 yrs old with my military dad, and my mom and younger bro. We stayed at the Grand Krasnopolsky downtown. Did the tourist things. Ate at the Five Flies.

In 1985, drove my family while living in the UK to Dover, ferried over to Ostend, and on to Holland. Stayed this time at the Amsterdam Hilton (where John and Yoko had their famous "bed in" for peace). Did the tourist things, Anne Frank house, canal ride,etc. Ate at the Five Flies. Spent a week driving elsewhere in Holland -- Scheveningen, Madurodam, Delft (my wife's ancestral hometown), Edam, Marken, etc.
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DJ Big Jack
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« Reply #46 on: April 10, 2017, 02:40:53 PM »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qz2M6XB8_3Y
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Robb_K
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« Reply #47 on: April 10, 2017, 02:51:32 PM »

In 1985, drove my family while living in the UK to Dover, ferried over to Ostend, and on to Holland. Stayed this time at the Amsterdam Hilton (where John and Yoko had their famous "bed in" for peace). Did the tourist things, Anne Frank house, canal ride,etc. Ate at the Five Flies. Spent a week driving elsewhere in Holland -- Scheveningen, Madurodam, Delft (my wife's ancestral hometown), Edam, Marken, etc.
THAT'S MY part of the country.  I lived in my grandparents' home for 40 years, on the last street on the west side of Den Haag, on the edge of Westbroek Park, of which, Maduram is in an enclave.  Whenever visitors came to me, we walked the two blocks to see Madurodam.  And we were the last street with houses, with only the woods (Westbroek Park, and The Scheveningse Bosjes) between us and that resort beach town.  Speaking of Scheveningen, have you seen the famous bronze statue, "De Visservrouw" (Fisherman's Wife) on The Strand there?  My great aunt posed for that back in the early 1930s.
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Shandy
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« Reply #48 on: April 10, 2017, 06:11:16 PM »

Robb - I made many friends of the locals and while I did the tourist thing the first time (I particularly enjoyed what I call The Flower Stock Market), they took me to many off the beaten path places that I loved.  A ladies fan museum where you had to make an appointment, beautiful places in the countryside, a private club under the canal.
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"The small man builds prisons for everyone he meets, but the wise woman ducks under the moon and tosses keys to the beautiful and rowdy prisoners."  Hafiz

"From childhood's hour I have not been as other were - have not seen as others saw - I could not drink(sic) my passions from a common stream.
Robb_K
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« Reply #49 on: April 10, 2017, 06:35:59 PM »

Robb - I made many friends of the locals and while I did the tourist thing the first time (I particularly enjoyed what I call The Flower Stock Market), they took me to many off the beaten path places that I loved.  A ladies fan museum where you had to make an appointment, beautiful places in the countryside, a private club under the canal.
I meant friends with whom you still have contact, and maybe came to visit you in USA.
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DJ Big Jack
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« Reply #50 on: April 11, 2017, 08:29:55 AM »

Robb,  Madurodam was just absolutely amazing.  I enjoyed all my time in Holland.   I even went to the cheese market/auction at Gouda.

I didn't get to see the statue, "De Visservrouw" , however .. but did see the "Little Mermain" in Copenhagen  Smiley ... does that count ?
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Shandy
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« Reply #51 on: April 11, 2017, 11:30:54 AM »

Robb - Yes, still in contact.  In fact my best Dutch friend, Peter ten Napel, moved here for two years!
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"The small man builds prisons for everyone he meets, but the wise woman ducks under the moon and tosses keys to the beautiful and rowdy prisoners."  Hafiz

"From childhood's hour I have not been as other were - have not seen as others saw - I could not drink(sic) my passions from a common stream.
jp05
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« Reply #52 on: April 12, 2017, 07:14:34 PM »

Amsterdam has many fine memories for me, particularly after I sold my company to a Amsterdam based company in 1990! Spent many days and nights there, and had some time to bring my wife and do some of the "tourist" things. Also spent time in Eindhoven on business and later as a tourist. Outside of the cities, it was a beautiful country.
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Robb_K
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« Reply #53 on: April 12, 2017, 07:32:53 PM »

Amsterdam has many fine memories for me, particularly after I sold my company to a Amsterdam based company in 1990! Spent many days and nights there, and had some time to bring my wife and do some of the "tourist" things. Also spent time in Eindhoven on business and later as a tourist. Outside of the cities, it was a beautiful country.
A friend of mine (whose daughter is one of my work/business partners) is an engineer who helped design Eindhoven's famous "football" (soccer) stadium.  Eindhoven has a very good football team.  We did a picture drawing/autograph signing session in the famous comic book shop there last year.  Yes, there is a lot of nice countryside to enjoy when you get out of the cities.  There are some nice forest areas in the eastern parts of the country.
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Robb_K
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« Reply #54 on: April 13, 2017, 01:26:25 AM »

Did you notice that I made a comment about that song on that page 2 years ago?  Someone told me that one of The Belmonts was of Dutch extraction, and spoke the language.  It's not very good.  But, then, I don't like Dutch Pop music very much.  Which is why I intend to donate my records to form an R&B/Soul Music museum in Den haag, when I get old (90 or so).  Actually, R&B and Soul are pretty popular here (at least in Noord en Zuid Holland).
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doowopdan in GA
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« Reply #55 on: April 17, 2017, 11:45:43 AM »

I'm really enjoying this conversation.  My parents took us on a "Benelux" two week vacation in 1974 as a Bar Mitzvah present (I had a choice between that and a traditional big party -- no contest).  It's the only time I've ever been overseas and it was great.  We tried to stay in small towns (my Dad speaks a little French and German, which helped - Huy is one I remember), *except* for Amsterdam, where we spent five days.  And yes, we walked through the Red Light District (most of the women looked bored, as I recall from 40+ years ago).  Mostly I remember the churches and castles (especially the one in Ghent), and how good the food was.  And I loved the little inns we stayed at -- it was like being invited into someone's home.  Just a wonderful experience in almost every way. 

I also have a college friend who grew up in Antwerp.  His mother stayed with us and she spoke, I think, a local dialect of Flemish (if there is such a thing).  Listening to them talk was unlike anything I've ever heard (many languages you can pick up a word here and there, but not that one).  He told me about how the northern half (Flemish) and the southern half (French) are like two different (and *very* small) countries.
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doowopdan in GA
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« Reply #56 on: April 17, 2017, 12:25:56 PM »

By the way, the word I'm really sick of is "So".  Every time I hear someone relatively youngish interviewed on NPR or CNN or MSNBC, every answer begins with "So,...".  I don't know how it started, but Patient Zero needs to be found and tortured to death. 
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Robb_K
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« Reply #57 on: April 17, 2017, 07:29:26 PM »

My parents took us on a "Benelux" two week vacation in 1974 as a Bar Mitzvah present. Mostly I remember the churches and castles (especially the one in Ghent), and how good the food was. Just a wonderful experience in almost every way. I have a college friend who grew up in Antwerp.  His mother stayed with us and she spoke, I think, a local dialect of Flemish (if there is such a thing).  Listening to them talk was unlike anything I've ever heard (many languages you can pick up a word here and there, but not that one).  He told me about how the northern half (Flemish) and the southern half (French) are like two different (and *very* small) countries.
Yes, Antwerp has its own distinct dialect of Flemish (as all big cities do).  it is a very old fashioned form of Dutch.  I know a family who came from a small town near Antwerp, when all of the Flemish lands (indeed, most of Belgium) was part of The Netherlands (Republic of The United Netherlands) in the early 1600s.  Their ancestors left there so their father could take a good job in the Dutch Colony of Indonesia (Oost Indie).  When the family returned t the same town in the late 1940s, when The Indonesians kicked The Dutch out, they found out their town was part of Belgium, and they (having 350 year old Dutch papers), were foreigners (Still Dutch, rather than Belgian).  So, they had to emigrate to The Netherlands and start over by renting.  Actually, old Dutch, is the closest major World language to English, and many hundreds of words are spelt similarly, but sound very different, and a few hundred words are spelt differently, but sound fairly close, at least recocgnisable, IF one knows the language and sentence context.  Frisian (Northern Netherlands, Germany just across the border from there (North Sea Coast, and southwestern Denmark (North Sea Coast), the only language closer (sister language of English).
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doctordoowop
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« Reply #58 on: April 17, 2017, 09:12:58 PM »

Outside  the box.   

Thanx for  3rd Ave  subway info  Shamdy.  I thought  new 2nd ave  was  elevated.   It'll take forever  to finish  underground.
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Shandy
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« Reply #59 on: April 17, 2017, 10:57:10 PM »

YW, doctor.  Nothing new is elevated anymore....trains, telephone, gas and electric....all below our feet.

Expression I hate that I can't stop using...."Know what I mean?"
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"The small man builds prisons for everyone he meets, but the wise woman ducks under the moon and tosses keys to the beautiful and rowdy prisoners."  Hafiz

"From childhood's hour I have not been as other were - have not seen as others saw - I could not drink(sic) my passions from a common stream.
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