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JoeC
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« on: September 28, 2020, 07:11:23 AM »

Another year without a Canadian team. Unless I'm misremembering, last Canadian team to win the Cup was Montreal, in 1993.

Just can't get into the Stars and Lightning. Was half-heartedly following the Islanders success but when they went out ...
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Robb_K
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« Reply #1 on: September 28, 2020, 12:04:58 PM »

Another year without a Canadian team. Unless I'm misremembering, last Canadian team to win the Cup was Montreal, in 1993.

Just can't get into the Stars and Lightning. Was half-heartedly following the Islanders success but when they went out ...

Same for me.  As a Canadian, it's been extremely frustrating.  If you want to play in your home country, you have absolutely NO chance to win The Stanley Cup.

I have no interest in The Finals this year.  The Jets, Hawks, and Blues were out early, and I have no relatives or friends playing for those 2 teams.
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JoeC
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« Reply #2 on: September 28, 2020, 01:02:46 PM »

Also, I wondered what the percentages of NHL player breakdown in terms of Canadians, Americans, Russians, Scandanavians, Eastern Europeans, etc. is these days.

Per Wiki, the league is down in 2020 to slightly less than 50% being Canadian players. Back in the '50s it had to be, what, 99% Canadian?That number started to drop in the 1970s and was down to 75% by the mid-1980s.   
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doctordoowop
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« Reply #3 on: September 29, 2020, 12:11:02 AM »

Watched no games-dont even know the channel.
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bklynmike101
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« Reply #4 on: September 29, 2020, 10:56:47 AM »

At least one Swiss - Roman Jossi. What they term as "ice hockey" seems to be very big in Switzerland these days, right behind tennis and soccer.

First discovering hockey hockey in the mid-60's, I regret the diminishing presence in particular of all those mellifluous French names of the Quebecois contingent back in the day. The Canadians roster seemed to be about 2/3-3/4 French Canadian. Where has Boom Boom Geoffrion gone? Not to mention the Richard's, the Tremblay's, Jacques Plante, Jacques Laperriere, and so many more.
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JoeC
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« Reply #5 on: September 29, 2020, 12:16:54 PM »

At least one Swiss - Roman Jossi. What they term as "ice hockey" seems to be very big in Switzerland these days, right behind tennis and soccer.

First discovering hockey hockey in the mid-60's, I regret the diminishing presence in particular of all those mellifluous French names of the Quebecois contingent back in the day. The Canadians roster seemed to be about 2/3-3/4 French Canadian. Where has Boom Boom Geoffrion gone? Not to mention the Richard's, the Tremblay's, Jacques Plante, Jacques Laperriere, and so many more.

I'm with you, Mike. THey added to hockey's exotic pull, at least with me.

My top years of rooting for the NY Rangers were 1955-59 (when I was 11-15 years old). The Rangers never had many French-Canadians back then. Their concentration in the Juniors with teams in Guelph and Winnipeg may explain why!

Only ones from my "wheelhouse years," would have been the diminutive but potent goal scorer, Camille Henry (from Quebec City) and Jean-Guy Gendron, from Montreal. For some reason, Gendron's nickname was "Smitty." Camille Henry scored the first goal against a NHL goaltender wearing a mask (Jacques Plante). The Eel was exciting as hell to watch!
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Robb_K
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« Reply #6 on: September 29, 2020, 12:50:53 PM »

At least one Swiss - Roman Jossi. What they term as "ice hockey" seems to be very big in Switzerland these days, right behind tennis and soccer.

First discovering hockey hockey in the mid-60's, I regret the diminishing presence in particular of all those mellifluous French names of the Quebecois contingent back in the day. The Canadians roster seemed to be about 2/3-3/4 French Canadian. Where has Boom Boom Geoffrion gone? Not to mention the Richard's, the Tremblay's, Jacques Plante, Jacques Laperriere, and so many more.

I'm with you, Mike. THey added to hockey's exotic pull, at least with me.

My top years of rooting for the NY Rangers were 1955-59 (when I was 11-15 years old). The Rangers never had many French-Canadians back then. Their concentration in the Juniors with teams in Guelph and Winnipeg may explain why!

Only ones from my "wheelhouse years," would have been the diminutive but potent goal scorer, Camille Henry (from Quebec City) and Jean-Guy Gendron, from Montreal. For some reason, Gendron's nickname was "Smitty." Camille Henry scored the first goal against a NHL goaltender wearing a mask (Jacques Plante). The Eel was exciting as hell to watch!

Yes, THAT was absolutely the reason.  There was no draft of Juniors or amateurs of any kind back then.  The 6 NHL teams got their players only by signing them to player contract agreements.  So, the teams had to sponsor youth teams to "grow the players in their own systems" , to get a piece of Montreal's and Toronto's pie.  The sponsored Junior level teams were funnels through which team's signee prospects would flow towards the big (professional team).  Winnipeg Metro Area boys like my town's, Andy Bathgate, would start in Juniors at age 16 or 17, playing for The Winnipeg Rangers of The Manitoba Junior Hockey League (which some of that period, was in Canada's Major Junior, Western Junior Hockey League), IF they were exceptionally good.  If not, they would stay in Midget one more year.  If the player played exceptionally well, he would be brought up to The Guelph Biltmores of Canada's highest level Major Junior League, The Ontario Hockey Association, when a replacement was needed, or when he played so well he was thought to improve their team, or he'd play a full year in Winnipeg, and be evaluated for moving up in next season's training camp. 
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JoeC
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« Reply #7 on: September 29, 2020, 01:38:50 PM »

Good stuff, Robb. You were there!

I wonder how the NYR got Camille Henry away from Montreal? He was a big goal scorer with the Quebec Citadelles in the QJHL (52 goals at age 18, followed by 46 when he was 20). He led the QJHL in scoring at age 19 with 114 points. I'm guessing maybe it was his small size at only 5'7, 150? Sad ending as he seems to have drank himself to death (complicated by diabetes) at age 64.

I recall Camille and Andy Hebenton winning the Lady Byng back to back during those late 1950s years. That was the Rangers problem, too many "gentlemen."

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Robb_K
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« Reply #8 on: September 29, 2020, 07:08:03 PM »

Good stuff, Robb. You were there!

I wonder how the NYR got Camille Henry away from Montreal? He was a big goal scorer with the Quebec Citadelles in the QJHL (52 goals at age 18, followed by 46 when he was 20). He led the QJHL in scoring at age 19 with 114 points. I'm guessing maybe it was his small size at only 5'7, 150? Sad ending as he seems to have drank himself to death (complicated by diabetes) at age 64.

I recall Camille and Andy Hebenton winning the Lady Byng back to back during those late 1950s years. That was the Rangers problem, too many "gentlemen."
Yes, The Habs had no room for Camille.  He was too small. and although shifty, with some good moves that worked in Juniors, they knew he was not fast enough to be a huge scorer in The NHL.  I went to 3 Rangers' summer camps.  I met Andy Hebenton and Andy Bathgate there.  I played in Winnipeg Arena as a midget (level just below Juniors) (WMJHL playoff games).  I played for West Kildonan in The Winnipeg Metro Hockey League.  We were a feeder team for The Winnipeg Rangers.  So, had I not joined my parents and siblings in moving to Chicago, and, instead, chosen to stay with my uncle and aunt in West Kildonan, to see where my hockey career could go, I'd probably have made it to The Winnipeg Rangers in 1963-64.  I think the chances weren't great that I would have made it to Guelph or The NHL Rangers.  But I would have been in The Rangers' farm system.  But, I wanted to get into environmental work, anyway.   Another Jew chose higher education instead of hockey.  Actually, I had hoped to get a hockey scholarship to a good US university (Michigan, Michigan State, Minnesota).  But, unfortunately, back at the beginning of the '60s The Chicago Metro Area didn't have a even a AAA level Junior League where I could play to be seen by college scouts.  In any case, I found out that NONE of the schools I might have gotten a scholarship from, could have offered the mix of courses and majors I wanted.  So, I ended up at UCLA, and went to school for absolutely nothing for all but my first year with out-of-state fees.  I was "Red" Klein.  I would have been one of a very few Jews in pro hockey - many of whom usually ended up with The Rangers or Blackhawks because of their large Jewish communities.  But there had been several with Les Canadiens, as well, as Montreal had a large Jewish community, of which most spoke French.  And I spoke French, too.  But life takes strange turns, and then, suddenly you're old, and your time is up.  And it's almost like it didn't matter, anyway.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2020, 02:19:12 PM by Robb_K » Logged

bklynmike101
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« Reply #9 on: September 30, 2020, 11:35:12 AM »

Joe,

Camille The Eel was one of my early favorites on the NYR. Along with Ingarfield & Hadfield, Nevin-Ratelle-Goyette, and Howell-Brown-Seiling-Nielson on the backline. I later met Giacomen while serving as "Security" for a (remarkably poorly attended) autograph session held in the sporting goods section of Abraham & Strauss's (A&S) flagship downtown Brooklyn store where I worked for a short time in the fall of '74. Poor Eddie. Not to mention his alter ego Gilles Villemure.

Robb,

As always, enjoyed your tales of being a real "player" in organized Canadian hockey circles. Recall Larry Zeidel, an AHL retread, stirring my interest when he was recalled to the NHL at about age 40, and managed to hang on a few years. Later became a stockbroker. During the era of the "original 6" with only some 108 (or thereabouts) roster spots, you had to be awfully awfully good to get into the NHL club. Thus hypothesis proved out when the first expansion to 12 teams came, as so many talented AHL players advanced to the NHL and had tremendous success at that level. Later on, working in SF, one of my colleagues was a guy who had played for Michigan (or Michigan State) and repeatedly told us how grateful he was to his dad who insisted he wear a mouth guard, against his wishes and subject to ridicule from teammates and staff, as a result of which all of his teeth were intact.

I remember seeing Art Stratton, whom I knew from his time with the NHL Penguins, playing and excelling for the local Rochester Americans when I managed a break from my studies to get to a game at the old "Rochester War Memorial" arena circa '72-'74. Perfect example of a "bubble" NHL guy, long-time AHL guy, who today would have been an NHL regular. Hey - just looked him up -  from your hometown Winnipeg, and still with us at age 84.         
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JoeC
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« Reply #10 on: September 30, 2020, 12:13:01 PM »

Mike, Envy your opportunity to meet a Ranger. Eddie was a great goalie. He stood up more than a lot of Goaltenders and he was a great stick handler (used to give fans heart attacks with his roaming away from the crease).

Robb, I don't think the NYR had any Jewish players - for quite awhile - after Hy Buller retired in 1954. If you had played for the Rangers, you coulda filled that void and been the toast of Broadway. You might have needed to change your nickname as the Rangers already had "Red" Sullivan, one of my all-time Ranger favorites. 

I mentioned in an earlier post (year or so ago) that Harry Howell, the Rangers Captain, was always boo'ed in the mid 50s by the MSG crowd. I never really knew why as he was well-regarded in the sport. Fans can be fickle. Anyway, when Red Sullivan came over from the Black Hawks in 1956-57, he immediately assumed the Captaincy.

I recently read an article from a few years before he died, where Howell said his play on the ice had suffered in that mid-50s period and he attributed that to the "weight" of being Captain in those years. Any idea why that would've been (I really know nothing about that role in hockey)?


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Robb_K
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« Reply #11 on: September 30, 2020, 12:29:29 PM »

Joe,

Camille The Eel was one of my early favorites on the NYR. Along with Ingarfield & Hadfield, Nevin-Ratelle-Goyette, and Howell-Brown-Seiling-Nielson on the backline. I later met Giacomen while serving as "Security" for a (remarkably poorly attended) autograph session held in the sporting goods section of Abraham & Strauss's (A&S) flagship downtown Brooklyn store where I worked for a short time in the fall of '74. Poor Eddie. Not to mention his alter ego Gilles Villemure.

Robb,

As always, enjoyed your tales of being a real "player" in organized Canadian hockey circles. Recall Larry Zeidel, an AHL retread, stirring my interest when he was recalled to the NHL at about age 40, and managed to hang on a few years. Later became a stockbroker. During the era of the "original 6" with only some 108 (or thereabouts) roster spots, you had to be awfully awfully good to get into the NHL club. Thus hypothesis proved out when the first expansion to 12 teams came, as so many talented AHL players advanced to the NHL and had tremendous success at that level. Later on, working in SF, one of my colleagues was a guy who had played for Michigan (or Michigan State) and repeatedly told us how grateful he was to his dad who insisted he wear a mouth guard, against his wishes and subject to ridicule from teammates and staff, as a result of which all of his teeth were intact.

I remember seeing Art Stratton, whom I knew from his time with the NHL Penguins, playing and excelling for the local Rochester Americans when I managed a break from my studies to get to a game at the old "Rochester War Memorial" arena circa '72-'74. Perfect example of a "bubble" NHL guy, long-time AHL guy, who today would have been an NHL regular. Hey - just looked him up -  from your hometown Winnipeg, and still with us at age 84.         

I remember Art Stratton when he was a kid, when I was first watching hockey near the beginning of the '50s.  He, and his brother, Gordie, both played for The AAA Winnipeg Barons of The Manitoba Junior Hockey League for a couple years.   After that, Art was brought up to The OHA's Major Junior A The St. Cathrines (Ont.)Teepees.  They were The Black Hawks' top Juniors team.  But, he wasn't good enough to make The Black Hawks, even though they were at the bottom of NHL talent at that time.  So, he ended up starting his pro career with The WHL Winnipeg Warriors, rejoining Gordie there.  The Western Hockey League was about a half-step down from The AHL at that time.  His rights were traded from The Chicago system to The Rangers' system, and he came up with them near the end of The '50s.
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Robb_K
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« Reply #12 on: September 30, 2020, 01:09:45 PM »

Mike, Envy your opportunity to meet a Ranger. Eddie was a great goalie. He stood up more than a lot of Goaltenders and he was a great stick handler (used to give fans heart attacks with his roaming away from the crease).

Robb, I don't think the NYR had any Jewish players - for quite awhile - after Hy Buller retired in 1954. If you had played for the Rangers, you coulda filled that void and been the toast of Broadway. You might have needed to change your nickname as the Rangers already had "Red" Sullivan, one of my all-time Ranger favorites. 

I mentioned in an earlier post (year or so ago) that Harry Howell, the Rangers Captain, was always boo'ed in the mid 50s by the MSG crowd. I never really knew why as he was well-regarded in the sport. Fans can be fickle. Anyway, when Red Sullivan came over from the Black Hawks in 1956-57, he immediately assumed the Captaincy.

I recently read an article from a few years before he died, where Howell said his play on the ice had suffered in that mid-50s period and he attributed that to the "weight" of being Captain in those years. Any idea why that would've been (I really know nothing about that role in hockey)?    

There is a LOT of pressure added to a player when he is a team's Captain.  He is the only player who can talk to The Refs.  He is the leader of the team in the locker room, and is responsible for settling player disputes, keeping up team morale, and taking team grievances and concerns to The Coach or Management.  He also feels responsible for keeping peace in the locker room.  The Captain is also chosen to represent his team to the press. Despite several players being interviewed before and after games, usually the Captain is interviewed significantly more, especially in making official statements from The players.  That has been getting more and more frequent and time consuming as the years go by.  So, in addition to added mental stress, all the interviews, and meetings are very time consuming, leading to less time to practise their skills.  The added mental pressure not only often makes players want to spend more time on lighter diversion, and less on training, but maybe having those responsibilities harping on them subconsciously in the back of their minds might result in the player being less aware while on the ice.  There have been studies proving that players who serve as team captains, on average, have worse years statistically during their years as Caaptain, than their years not as Captain.  It has gotten to the point that several teams in The NHL and AHL choose to NOT have a team captain, and go with 3 or 4 Alternate Captains (ALL wearing the "A" only -e.g. NOT switching the "C" from one to another).  And that has worked better.  The burdens are a lot worse now, than they were in Howell's heyday.
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JoeC
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« Reply #13 on: September 30, 2020, 01:58:07 PM »

Robb, thanks for that. The incessant booing of Harry Howell in the mid 1950s at MSG has always stuck with me. As I said, fans are indeed very fickle.

I recall Pee Wee Reese being the Captain of the Brooklyn Dodgers. I guess he had many of the same type "duties," sans the part about dealing with umpires.

Another player that was boo'd heavily in the mid thru late 1950s (when I went often to Yankee Stadium) was, shockingly, Mickey Mantle. Even in his Triple Crown year of 1956. With Mick, it was his strikeouts. He'd K 3x in a game and hit a tape measure shot to win a game and the next game the boo-birds were back. He led the AL in strikeouts in 5 seasons (1952, 54, 58, 59 and 60). In his worst year, 1959, he struck out 126x, about 20% of his ABs. He also led the league in Walks 5x.
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Robb_K
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« Reply #14 on: September 30, 2020, 02:15:39 PM »

Robb, thanks for that. The incessant booing of Harry Howell in the mid 1950s at MSG has always stuck with me. As I said, fans are indeed very fickle.

I recall Pee Wee Reese being the Captain of the Brooklyn Dodgers. I guess he had many of the same type "duties," sans the part about dealing with umpires.

Another player that was boo'd heavily in the mid thru late 1950s (when I went often to Yankee Stadium) was, shockingly, Mickey Mantle. Even in his Triple Crown year of 1956. With Mick, it was his strikeouts. He'd K 3x in a game and hit a tape measure shot to win a game and the next game the boo-birds were back. He led the AL in strikeouts in 5 seasons (1952, 54, 58, 59 and 60). In his worst year, 1959, he struck out 126x, about 20% of his ABs. He also led the league in Walks 5x.   

Ha! Ha!  It seems that New York and Philly fans had something in common, after all!   Grin
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Robb_K
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« Reply #15 on: September 30, 2020, 02:45:00 PM »

Mike, Envy your opportunity to meet a Ranger. Eddie was a great goalie. He stood up more than a lot of Goaltenders and he was a great stick handler (used to give fans heart attacks with his roaming away from the crease).

Robb, I don't think the NYR had any Jewish players - for quite awhile - after Hy Buller retired in 1954. If you had played for the Rangers, you coulda filled that void and been the toast of Broadway. You might have needed to change your nickname as the Rangers already had "Red" Sullivan, one of my all-time Ranger favorites.  

I mentioned in an earlier post (year or so ago) that Harry Howell, the Rangers Captain, was always boo'ed in the mid 50s by the MSG crowd. I never really knew why as he was well-regarded in the sport. Fans can be fickle. Anyway, when Red Sullivan came over from the Black Hawks in 1956-57, he immediately assumed the Captaincy.

I recently read an article from a few years before he died, where Howell said his play on the ice had suffered in that mid-50s period and he attributed that to the "weight" of being Captain in those years. Any idea why that would've been (I really know nothing about that role in hockey)?

Just call me Methuseleh!!!  Grin  I'm not nearly as old as you think.  Red Sullivan's last year with The Rangers was 1960-61.  I was 15 then, playing Midget hockey.   So, we wouldn't have crossed paths, probably even when he coached The Rangers in 63-64 and 64-65.  My first and only Junior year was 1963-64 at 17.  During the pre-expansion years, most players weren't making The NHL at 19 or 20.  They were lucky to get there by 23 or 24.  I wasn't good enough to EVER make The NHL.  But, if by some miracle I would have come up for "a cup of coffee" with The Rangers, maybe it would have been at age 24, after some good AHL or CHL years, that would have been 1969-70.  So, I'd have missed Sullivan, even as coach.  But, let's pretend I was a much better player, and 10 years older.  Red Sullivan was tiny, at 5:11 and playing at 155 lb!  I was not big for my time, but, at 6:01 and 1/2 185 lb, I would have been reasonably big for Sullivan's time.  I could have been called "Big Red", and Red Sullivan, "Little Red".  Or he could have been called "Old Red", and I, "Young Red".  Or I could have been called "The Heb".   Cheesy

I would have loved to play together in The NHL with my hero, Andy Bathgate.  And if I had been born 10 years earlier, I'd have been only a couple years behind him.
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jp05
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« Reply #16 on: September 30, 2020, 04:26:59 PM »

I really enjoyed this string! Without first hand knowledge of being a good player, my son was a D1 player who spent a few years after college kicking around the ECHL and one or two others. But 4 years of bus rides and bruises (and a few concussions) convinced him to "retire" back to finish college. I still think that hockey (youth, college, pro at any level or the beer leagues are is the best sports playable until you are at least in your 50's.

Back to the Stanley Cup, the games got better as the weeks went on. I now live in Florida about 2 hours south of Tampa and ocassionally go to see the 'Bolts', was rooting for them to win. Actually, I really enjoy playoff hockey when the loser goes home. The tempo picks up, the hitting is harder and usually legal, so its very watchable. OT is even better! I thought that Pointe would win the Conn Smyth trophy, but was rooting for Hedman who was the best player in my opinion.

Finally, while playing in Edmonton was good, the lack of fans sucked and I'm sure they could have found a clear audience to at least fill half the arena.
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JoeC
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« Reply #17 on: September 30, 2020, 05:59:16 PM »

jp, congrats on the Bolts win. Hedman is truly great. He is one BIG guy. I recall when he was the top Euro player going into the NHL draft one year. Point, Stamkos, Killorn and the others are pretty darn good too. Bolts always seem to draft well.

Robb, talking about the small size of Red Sullivan and Camille Henry got me thinking about the player who was my first Ranger favorite, Danny Lewicki. Another little guy who my 1955 Ranger game program tells me was 5'8, 147. Also says he could've played with the Leafs in 1949-50 at age 18 (but didn't come up until the next year at 19, because of a dispute with Conn Smythe). He must have been great in Juniors to have been able to impress the Leafs at such a young age!

My recollection of Danny was he was fast, a great stick handler, and very hard to hit (a good thing for him at under 150). Another Ranger "nice guy" (he finished 2nd in at least one Lady Byng Trophy vote).

I'll end with a Canadian question that Wiki didn't answer. DO you know WHY towns like Fort William (Lewicki's home town) and others "amalgamated" into Thunder Bay in 1970? There was a close vote (razor thin margin) that selected "Thunder Bay" over "Lakehead" as the new name but ... doesn't give a reason. 

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Robb_K
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« Reply #18 on: September 30, 2020, 08:39:26 PM »

DO you know WHY towns like Fort William (Lewicki's home town) and others "amalgamated" into Thunder Bay in 1970? There was a close vote (razor thin margin) that selected "Thunder Bay" over "Lakehead" as the new name but ... doesn't give a reason. 

That would likely be a tough question for most Canadians not from Ontario.  Most Canadians born before 1960 probably know that The City of Thunder Bay was formed by the former Port Arthur and Fort William joining together, but there never was any deep secret as to why they did that.  First of all, it happened after I left Canada.  The Lakehead Twin Cities were always Fort William and Port Arthur to me.  They had separate histories.  Port Arthur was the western shipping terminus for Canadian boats and later ships on The Great Lakes.  Fort William was the starting point for canoe traveling by portage westward into Manitoba.  It was where The Hudson's Bay Co. Trading Post was located.  When The Canadian Transcontinental Railway was being planned, both rival cities were fighting to house the western terminus of the Eastern Segment of that railroad line.  In 1920, and again, in 1958 the regional government and both cities asked for a study to see if it were practical to amalgamate.  But, each time they voted it down.  In 1948, The Mayor of Port Arthur(currently in office) ran for Mayor of Fort William.  In 1965, The Regional Government and both cities requested another study, and this time, the findings were favourable, both cities signed off on it, they approached the Provincial Government and got approval.  

My guess is that because both cities faced basically, the same problems, they decided that pooling their resources, and having a larger scale of operations , would be more cost-efficient than having two smaller operations, and some wasting of resources due to duplication of some services by The Regional government.  The two cities merging, and taking in their semi-rural expansion-path areas Neebing and McIntyre, would have the resulting city, Thunder Bay, more or less match the regional government area, and so eliminate the need for the latter to provide any services, because the new city would be doing everything on the city level.
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doctordoowop
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« Reply #19 on: October 01, 2020, 03:01:13 AM »

I recalll being surprised when I read that Harry Howell was Jewish.  Maybe it was Bill Gadsby getting booed.Robb--name a few Jewish NHL players---I only  know Howell. 
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JoeC
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« Reply #20 on: October 01, 2020, 07:42:03 AM »

I recalll being surprised when I read that Harry Howell was Jewish.  Maybe it was Bill Gadsby getting booed.Robb--name a few Jewish NHL players---I only  know Howell. 
One of the Plagers converted to Judaism (I think when he got married).

And it was definitely Howell who was the "target" in those mid 1950s years. Every time he touched the puck, they started. The Rangers were not good in those years.

Maybe Harry was singled out because he was Captain of those poor teams, maybe it was that he was not flashy (not Lou Fontinato, style-wise), maybe because he didn't score goals like Bill Gadsby, who knows? Personally, I just think NYR fans were just tremendously frustrated in those years and Harry became the whipping boy.

All ended well, though, with him wining the Norris Trophy in the late 60s, becoming a HoF player and having his jersey retired to the Garden rafters.
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bklynmike101
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« Reply #21 on: October 01, 2020, 12:28:34 PM »

I recalll being surprised when I read that Harry Howell was Jewish.  Maybe it was Bill Gadsby getting booed.Robb--name a few Jewish NHL players---I only  know Howell. 

Mathieu Schneider, Mike Veisor, and Bob Nystrom (per some sources) come readily to mind.
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bklynmike101
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« Reply #22 on: October 01, 2020, 12:31:07 PM »

Howell was well admired by me and my buddy NYR fans. But that was mid-60's and afterwards when he had already established himself as leader of the NYR backline corps. I had never heard he was (possibly Jewish until well after his playing days had ended.
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bklynmike101
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« Reply #23 on: October 01, 2020, 12:33:25 PM »

Mike, Envy your opportunity to meet a Ranger. Eddie was a great goalie. He stood up more than a lot of Goaltenders and he was a great stick handler (used to give fans heart attacks with his roaming away from the crease).

Robb, I don't think the NYR had any Jewish players - for quite awhile - after Hy Buller retired in 1954. If you had played for the Rangers, you coulda filled that void and been the toast of Broadway. You might have needed to change your nickname as the Rangers already had "Red" Sullivan, one of my all-time Ranger favorites.  

I mentioned in an earlier post (year or so ago) that Harry Howell, the Rangers Captain, was always boo'ed in the mid 50s by the MSG crowd. I never really knew why as he was well-regarded in the sport. Fans can be fickle. Anyway, when Red Sullivan came over from the Black Hawks in 1956-57, he immediately assumed the Captaincy.

I recently read an article from a few years before he died, where Howell said his play on the ice had suffered in that mid-50s period and he attributed that to the "weight" of being Captain in those years. Any idea why that would've been (I really know nothing about that role in hockey)?

Just call me Methuseleh!!!  Grin  I'm not nearly as old as you think.  Red Sullivan's last year with The Rangers was 1960-61.  I was 14 then, playing Midget hockey.   So, we wouldn't have crossed paths, probably even when he coached The Rangers in 63-64 and 64-65.  My first and only Junior year was 1963-64 at 17.  During the pre expansion years, most players weren't making The NHL at 19 or 20.  They were lucky to get there by 23 or 24.  I wasn't good enough to EVER make The NHL.  But, if by some miracle I would have come up for "a cup of coffee" with The Rangers, maybe it would have been at age 24, after some good AHL or CHL years, that would have been 1969-70.  So, I'd have missed Sullivan, even as coach.  But, let's pretend I was a much better player, and 10 years older.  Red Sullivan was tiny, at 5:11 and playing at 155 lb!  I was not big for my time, but, at 6:01 and 1/2 185 lb, I would have been reasonably big for Sullivan's time.  I could have been called "Big Red", and Red Sullivan, "Little Red".  Or he could have been called "Old Red", and I, "Young Red".  Or I could have been called "The Heb".   Cheesy

I would have loved to play together in The NHL with my hero, Andy Bathgate.  And if I had been born 10 years earlier, I'd have been only a couple years behind him.


Let's not forger Red Berenson who had an undistinguished career for NYR but later found success with S.L.
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Robb_K
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« Reply #24 on: October 01, 2020, 01:33:12 PM »

I recalll being surprised when I read that Harry Howell was Jewish.  Maybe it was Bill Gadsby getting booed.Robb--name a few Jewish NHL players---I only  know Howell. 
One of the Plagers converted to Judaism (I think when he got married).    

It was Bob Plager, who converted to Judaism.

Cecil Hart, for whom The Hart Trophy was named, and one of the early legendary coaches of Les Canadiens, was Jewish.  He played the game, but was too old to play in The NHL, when it started in 1917.  Alex Levinsky, a defenceman in The NHL throughout The 1930s, played for The Leafs, Rangers and Black Hawks.  Larry Zeidel, Red Wings, Blackhawks, Flyers.  There was a long gap without any Jewish players.  During recent times there have been many - off the top of my head, some that weren't mentioned above:  Mike Veisor, Steve Dubinsky (Rangers' draftee played with several NHL teams), Jason Zucker, Eric Nystrom (Bob's son), Jeff Halpern, Mike Cammaleri, Adam Fox, Adam Henrich, Jakob Chychrun, Mike Hartman, Ross Brooks, Robert Burakovsky, Tanner Glass, Brett Stirling, Luke Kunin (from St. Louis), and, believe it or not...Josh Ho-Sang (Chinese/Canadian Jew?). Grin
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Robb_K
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« Reply #25 on: October 01, 2020, 01:51:09 PM »


Jewish players - for quite awhile - after Hy Buller retired in 1954. If you had played for the Rangers, you coulda filled that void and been the toast of Broadway. You might have needed to change your nickname as the Rangers already had "Red" Sullivan, one of my all-time Ranger favorites.  

Just call me Methuseleh!!!  Grin  I'm not nearly as old as you think.  Red Sullivan's last year with The Rangers was 1960-61.  I was 14 then, playing Midget hockey.   So, we wouldn't have crossed paths, probably even when he coached The Rangers in 63-64 and 64-65.  My first and only Junior year was 1963-64 at 17.  During the pre expansion years, most players weren't making The NHL at 19 or 20.  They were lucky to get there by 23 or 24.  I wasn't good enough to EVER make The NHL.  But, if by some miracle I would have come up for "a cup of coffee" with The Rangers, maybe it would have been at age 24, after some good AHL or CHL years, that would have been 1969-70.  So, I'd have missed Sullivan, even as coach.  But, let's pretend I was a much better player, and 10 years older.  Red Sullivan was tiny, at 5:11 and playing at 155 lb!  I was not big for my time, but, at 6:01 and 1/2 185 lb, I would have been reasonably big for Sullivan's time.  I could have been called "Big Red", and Red Sullivan, "Little Red".  Or he could have been called "Old Red", and I, "Young Red".  Or I could have been called "The Heb".   Cheesy

I would have loved to play together in The NHL with my hero, Andy Bathgate.  And if I had been born 10 years earlier, I'd have been only a couple years behind him.

Let's not forget Red Berenson who had an undistinguished career for NYR but later found success with S.L.
[/quote]

This seems totally out of context here.  WHY should we not forget Red Berenson?  He was a great player.  And as a Blues' fan, he was one of my all-time favourites.  But what did he have to do with any of the conversations above?  He certainly wasn't Jewish.  And he didn't come from Winnipeg.  -Oh!  I see now!  He had the nickname Red!  And, unlike Red Sullivan, had I been good enough to make The Rangers in 1966-67, HE would have been on the team.  HE would have been Old Red, and I, Young Red, as our sizes were pretty much the same,  Or he would have been "Saskatchewan  Red" , and I "Manitoba Red".  Or he'd have been "Farm Boy", and I "Jew Boy".  
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doctordoowop
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« Reply #26 on: October 01, 2020, 11:29:42 PM »

Thanx Robb. Wow quite a few.
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Robb_K
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« Reply #27 on: October 01, 2020, 11:48:22 PM »

Thanx Robb. Wow quite a few. 

I'm sure there have been several more in recent years that I couldn't remember, or don't know about.  They are mostly Canadian, but notice that there were a few Swedes.  There are also some German, Swiss, Finnish, and French Jewish players, but none of them are likely to get good enough.  No known phenoms there, so far.
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